I feel like Sam Malone from this episode of "Cheers," when the charmingly nefarious Henri successfully baits Sam into a contest over who can get the most ladies' phone numbers in one night.
While the quote isn't on this IMDb page, I believe Sam screams, "You shouldn't have brought America into this, Henri!" J-Rock, a little help?
Anyway, I feel compelled to address Dennis' complaints (yes, Dennis is Henri in my scenario. Perhaps I need a vacation) about the Yankees' veterans' reaction to Joba Chamberlain's shift to the bullpen. All the more so after reading John Harper's column this morning in The Daily News.
Harp wrote a terrific column in which Johnny Damon questioned the Joba move in a somewhat polite manner. This is not surprising. The veterans' job is to win now, this year, and they know how great Joba was in that eighth-inning role.
As I blogged here when the Yankees first made the move, a few weeks ago, the clamor would've been far louder had the Yankees actually been playing well at the time. Instead, the lack of eighth-inning opportunities for Joba probably opened some players' eyes _ or, at the least, made them realize it wouldn't make them look good to complain.
So what would I say to Johnny Damon?
1) Sometimes, an organization has to take a step back to take two or more steps forward. For instance, the Red Sox opted to let Damon go to the Yankees after the 2005 season, and in 2006, Damon outplayed his Boston replacement, Coco Crisp, by a country mile. But now, the Red Sox have the defensively excellent Crisp in center and the extremely promising Jacoby Ellsbury in leftfield. I bet those veterans don't miss Damon, still a nice player but overpaid at $13 million, anymore. I bet they did in 2006.
You don't want to tell your players, "We're thinking more about next year than this year." But that's precisely what the Yankees are doing, and it's the smart play.
2) A year ago, do you think Damon had even heard of Joba Chamberlain? If Damon passed by Mark Melancon or J.B. Cox on the street, would he have any clue whom they are? Perhaps one of them will eventually be this year's Joba. I know, it sounds crazy now, but what if I had told you on June 5, 2007 that Chamberlain would be the key to the team's second half?
To reiterate, I do think the Yankees should've started the season with Joba in a six-man rotation, so that pitch counts would not have been a factor as they were Tuesday night and also to avoid, somewhat, the veterans' grumbling _ in only that they would've understood from the very beginning that this was the way it was going to be. But it is what it is.
Comments (27)
Ken, first off thanks for metioning my name in your Blog. Would the Yankees had made this move if Hudges and Kennedy have pitch well and Mussina pitching like is right now and the Yanks in first place in the AL East? I doubt it. Speaking of Mussina, whoever thunk it that Moose will be tied for the AL lead with 9 wins. Moose has more wins than Hudges, Kennedy and Joba combined. I'm sure Yankees fans like me are not to thrill of the propsects of seeing a bunch of Red Sox in the All-star game At Yankee Stadium. Its bad enough that Terry Francona (who I have nothing against him) is the Al manager. Yankees fans I encourage you vote, and vote for as many Yankees players as you can. Pherhaps the Red Sox will bring bad karma, and the NL wouuld win the All-Star game for a change.
Ditto on John Smoltz. He should be very proud of a terrific career. We live in a "NOW"generation in every facet of our lives. There is a general lack of maturity, comprehension and patience to take a long term view of anything. Atleast Cashman has the courage and integrity to take a reallistic assessment of the present and future. There are no guarantees. Nice job Brian!
Ken, if you were the Mets would you try to draft college players in the earlier rounds, since they usually develop a lot faster than prep players? Obviously that would only be logical if the college players are comparable to the prep players in terms of talent when their turn arrives to pick a player.
I give Damon some credit - at least he shows concern and desire to win and not just collect a large Yankee paycheck.
To stir the pot a little, weren't the Yankees players quoted as wanting to win titles for some of their veteran additions (Clemens, Boggs) in the past decade? I cannot remember anyone saying something like this for Mussina, Giambi or A-Rod.
If I was still in NY, I'd be more upset that Fox TV is shutting down a whole lot of midtown Manhattan during the prime midday traffic period to do a fake made-for-TV parade they have no business disrupting the city for than having 5 Sox in the starting lineup. Most of them deserve to be there. As for Mussina, if he is leading the league in wins at the time when the pitchers get named, since it is a Yankee home game, he should go. What is more surprising to me is that despite best laid plans, it appears that the Moose will be back in the Bronx next season with at least an option for the season after that. How can they dump their most dependable starting pitcher when they don't have a complete rotation as is and Andy Pettitte will probably quit when this season is over? Even if they sign CC Sabathia, they still need a 3, 4 and 5 starter.
Of the 57 AL starters who have pitched 50+ innings Mussina is currently ranked:
* 29th in ERA
* 40th in K / 9 innings
* 41st in Hits/9 innings
* 43rd in terms of VORP (oooh scary scary VORP!)
* The Yankees have scored an average of 5.0 runs/game in his starts and 4.3 runs/game in other starts so he has had the benefit of better support relative to his teammates.
on the other hand:
* 5th in BB/9 Innings - that's good.
* He has a .301 BABIP - which indicates he has been a little unlucky on balls in play - the norm is about .290
* He has a cool last name that the home crowd can chant during the game and Francona will be guilted in to picking an extra Yankee lest the hallowed grounds where Ruth and Mantle and Tartabull played be tainted.
Ken, you're right, he's not even close to an All-Star, but you'll get plenty of debate. Sounds like a "Neil Best" strategy to boost page views.... (just kidding, Neil)
Hahaha Ken, very good! It's funny, when I heard Mussina was the league leader in victories yesterday, I litterally said to myself, "Maybe Ken has a point."
Here is my debate though. No he definitely is not an All-Star. Not even close. But he's gutsy this year. I used to have no respect for him because I hate cant beat them join them guys like Giambi, Mussina, Clemens etc. The Yanks are the last team I would have played for...because I'd want to beat them.
But this year, he's been very very very gutsy. He's litterally pitched on the black all year and probably has done it better than anyone can with his stuff. I've found myself rooting for him a little. So I think the W's aren't meaningless, their misleading. He's not an All-Star, but he is gutsy. And for me, his high amount of victories prove that.
I don't think Andy Pettitte wants to quit after this year. If you read what he said when he signed on for this year, he clearly indicted he wants to play a few more years. It's hard to turn down a boatload of money. I do think the Yankees should part ways with him after this year.
Dennis: How many times must it be repeated that this was the plan for Joba no matter what? It wasn't dictated by circumstances. This was the plan. Period. If Wang, Pettitte, Mussina, Hughes and Kennedy were all 10-0 with an 0.00 ERA at the time Joba was ready, innings-wise, this was going to be the plan.
Bryan, if I were the Mets, I would go simply with high-ceiling players, whether they're in high school or college. They drafted Joe Smith up high ((third round) in '06, and he came right up, and while he's a nice player, I don't think he should be a model for drafting. I think it would be foolish to draft college players solely because they're "close to being ready."
Bob, in the early years of the Yankees "drought," there absoutely was that sense of "We've got to get these guys rings," referring to Mussina, Giambi, A-Rod and others. That has dissipated with time, naturally, since only a select few still have rings.
Sandy, I know we all love to talk about "next year," but I think it's just way too early for that. What happens if Pettitte delivers a trademark second half? As Jim said, Pettitte has expressed an interest in pitching beyond this year, although that was before the Clemens stuff and his son's accident. What happens if Hughes and/or Kennedy turn it around? At this point, I'd be surprised if Mussina came back for '09.
Richie G., wins are absolutely not meaningless. But they are considerably overrated.
I see that the Yankees and Cashman are talking contract extension this weekend and it certainly appears Hank wants to keep him. Hank placed the ball squarely in Cash's court, although he said he understands Cashman wants to stay. As I wrote a few days ago, it doesn't surprise me a bit. Both sides really need each other.
I don't know Ken. The staff should have 2 veterans at least. if Andy decides to come back, no problem. If he doesn't and CC goes elsewhere, big problem. Andy should be a good guy and decide early in the off-season instead of January, so Cashman can make moves. If he goes and CC doesn't come, I'd offer Moose a guaranteed $4 million contract with incentives. I don't think he has any leverage because I doubt anyone else would sign him.
Obviously we all hope Joba steps up and Hughes comes back and pitches like he did at the end of last season. Then there's Rasner and Kennedy. Kennedy only pitches well in short spurts, do you think he might the best guy to fill the set-up role?
I think Pettitte would want to come back. The question is whether the Yankees want him back. I'm sure they do and especially not at $16 million.
I'm not sure the Yankees want Pettitte back (left out the key word earlier) and certainly not at $16 million a season.
Sandy, first of all, forget Sabathia. If Cashman sticks around (and despite the story out today, I don't think that'll be resolved until the end of the year), he's not going to be the sucker who winds up giving C.C a six-year deal.
Second of all, my only point is it's way too early to start projecting the 2009 rotation, particularly when it comes to veterans. I also think it's too early to project Kennedy to the setup role. By year's end, we'll have seen a returned Hughes and Kennedy, Melancon, Cox, how Mussina and Pettitte hold up, whether Wang fixes himself, etc. We'll have a lot more information at our disposal - as will the Yankees, obviously.
Ken, the Yankees have a $200 million plus payroll. The roster is constructed to win now. The Yankees should have made a decison one way or the other before the season on Joba. Either make him a starter at the beginning of the season or keep him in the pen for the whole season. I hate the fact they take him out of the pen during the season and put him the rotation. If you are going to make him a starter do it in spring training right off the bat not dring the season
Dennis, I agree with you that they should've made them a starter, in a six-man rotation, at the season's outset. But I disagree with you about the roster being built to "win now." The everyday lineup might be built that way, but the pitching staff isn't. The pitching staff is built for the long term. You can't judge a roster by its payroll. You have to judge it by the actual players on it.
The only way Joba could have started the season as a starter is with a six man rotation or else he would have exceeded the 140 innings ceiling before the summer was over. A long rotation might not be in the best interests of a sinkerball pitcher like Wang.
Ken, it should be noted Farnsworth got credit for the win today, thusly proving your point that wins are overrated. While KF sometimes appears unhittable, he is way too inconsistent to merit anyone ever having any faith in him.
Jim, Farnsworth stinks and everybody knows it. Yet the Yanks don't have the guts to cut him because they feel that Farnsworth can help them. Ken, Pettite, Mussina and Rivera are guys that are here to win now. All 3 are over 35 years old.
We are having a helluva pre-game show to Lakers vs. Celtics down here with Rays vs. Red Sox old skool from 2005. A big fight in the 2nd inning and, apparently there was just a fight in the Red Sox dugout between Manny and maybe Youkilis. We don't get FSN where I live but I'm listening on the Rays radio and they just reported this.
Dennis, Dennis, Dennis. Pettitte, Mussina and Rivera constitute 25 percent of the pitching staff, and only Rivera is signed past 2008. I'm not sure what "guts" have to do with cutting Farnsworth. Brains, definitely, but guts?
Ken, what I meant by guts is the Yanks don't want to eat up Farnsworth salary and cut him. The same goes with Hawkins.
Dennis--Girardi seems to like Farnsworth, he caught him when they were both Cubs. Maybe he sees something he can have corrected. Still he sux.
But it's not like the Yankees are having Farnsworth rot away in the bullpen, Dennis. They're using him in high-leverage situations. That's the opposite of no guts. That's courageously stupid.
Ken, review a few things:
1. Too many of us (me) jumped the gun on Mussina and Giambi. I said they were done. Not so. Nine wins and 12 HRs means they have something to give to the team. Would I bring back Mussina? Probably not. Would I bring back Giambi? Definitely not, unless he agreed to the same $1.5 million that Bernie did in his last year.
2. I might have been wrong in thinking the Yankees blew it in not signing Wang to a multi-year extension in spring training when he offered what I thought were reasonable financial terms. When he got off to a fast start I grumbled that Cashman blew it and the Yankees would pay the price at the end of the year. Maybe not.
3. I thought it was wrong to go into the season with two unproven starters and a third waiting in the wings (Joba). I thought Cashman should have made a play for 29-year old right hander Kyle Lohse, who signed with the Cardinals and is 6-2 in 13 starts. I still think the Yankees should have signed him.
4. I think Joe Girardi and Kevin Long are both doing good jobs. I think Dave Eiland is working his tail off, but the verdict is still out on if he can be successful at this level. After yesterday's game, Mussina gave a long interview about what he has been doing to reinvent himself. He didn't mention Eiland's name. Either Eiland hasn't done much to help or Mussina needs to learn how express a little gratitude.
5. Here’s something we all knew from the get-go: Kyle Farnsworth is terrible and will go down as one of Cashman’s worse signings ever. He had a horrible second half before he came to the Yankees and why they gave him $21 million is still a mystery to lots of us.
I'm with you on having thought Mussina was done, Jim. I'll ask him about Eiland. The G-Man, his career has been such a roller coaster that I wasn't ready to write him off yet.
I understand your thinking on Lohse, but as we know, Cashman wanted to give the youngsters every opportunity to succeed this year. If that meant missing the playoffs, then so be it. And yes, I agree that not committing to Wang was smart and signing Farnsworth was historically awful.
Ken, Farnsworth should have been gone already. Why can't they just flat out cut him and eat his salary is beyond me. The Yanks giving Robinson Cano $32 million is not working out so far. Prehaps Cano doesn't know how to handle expectations.
Dennis, I think I'm going to have to keep you after school and give you a course in reading comprehension.
IT'S NOT AN ISSUE OF EATING HIS SALARY!!! IT'S AN ISSUE OF, THEY STILL THINK HE'S GOOD!!! IF THEY DIDN'T THINK HE WAS GOOD, THEN THEY WOULDN'T BE USING HIM IN HIGH-LEVERAGE SITUATIONS!!!
To make clear, I think they're morons for still thinking he's good. But that is the problem - not a reluctance to eat the money.