On the Yankees beat

Drew: In case you've switched threads, I responded on the previous thread regarding IPK.

Got it...

Just read the Yanks are going after Demaso Marte from Pitt. Can anyone confirm?

The bullpen is definitely a concern of mine. If Hughes, Joba, and Kennedy are all in the rotation, I would imagine at this point in their careers, the Yankees will put inning limits on the trio, so the bullpen is going to have to do a good job getting the ball to Mariano with a lead. I don't think Vizacaino will be back, either. Also, we don't really have a lefty reliever that I trust. I don't like Henn.

I want to see more of Edwar Ramirez and Ohlendorf. Maybe Horne can contribute to the bullpen or Humberto Sanchez? Veras impressed also.

Where do the likes of Karstens, Rasner, Chase Wright (to a lesser extent - though maybe not (lefty), etc. - the mediocre starters of the Yankee farm system fit into the bullpen plans?

I would prefer going with inexpensive options in the pen, though it would be nice to have a few southpaws in there (at least two) for matchup purposes.

My pen would be:

Rivera
Farnsworth - he looked better toward the end of the year when he mixed in some offspeed pitches - maybe the change of manager will have a positive effect on this nutbar... (yes...I realize it is wishful thinking.
Ramirez - too only follow a flamethrower
Britton - this guy deserves a shot
Marte - go get him from Pittsburgh
Karstens - long relief/spot starter
Rasner - before he got hurt, he was getting guys out
Wright - second lefty in the pen...see what he can do.

Dont forget about the new guy we trade Clip for =

http://riveraveblues.com/2007/12/04/prospect-profile-jon-albaladejo/

Looks like he's a strike thrower.

Also, I cant wait to see who Girardi handles the bullpen. Joe caught Farny when they were on the Cubs. Apparently he has a good relationship with him. Hopefully Joe can tap into his potential. On top of that Torre was never the best at giving the young guys a fair shot in the pen. I never understood why he didnt use Chris Britton more. Very interesting to see how he uses the young guys like Britton, Ohlendorf, Edwar (minor league RP of the year), etc.

expect either whelan, sanchez, cox, or others to get a shot of making the team alsso.

marte would help..

no on viz and mahay...

go with young arms.. Personally I trade Krazy Kyle and save $4+ mill...

Cant wait for Sanchez, Cox and Melancon to recover from their injuries. They could be our best RP's when healthy, most likely not until we open up across the street.

Hey everyone,

Talk about it here! We have a great sports forum that just started last week and we already have 140 members. We really have started well. We have forums for MLB, NBA, NFL, NHL, college sports, general sports, music, movies, gernal talk, etc. However, we need more members to insure we stay active. We have a Baseball Mogul 2008 league, an MLB trade center, and a fastbreak basketball league all on our sports forum. Thanks for your time and I hope I see you there!
www.overtimesports.tk

I really do hope that Viz's price prevents the Yankees from re-signing him. I would expect Torre's overuse to deleteriously impact him even more next season than it did at the end of this season.

What are your opinions as to what the Yanks should do with Igawa? I just read that the Padres are looking at Glendon Rusch and Shawn Estes to fill out their last rotation spot and I'd have to think that they would be interested in Igawa, perhaps in return for some bullpen help? I know the Phillies are short on pitching but I don't think Igawa would fare very well in that ballpark.
Any other ideas? How about Houston?

Igawa or what I like to call him, Kiwi, is under contract for cheap..I believe 4 or 5 M per for the next 4. I think a trade to the Padres who have an excellent bullpen could work. If we keep him, maybe the new pitching coach (worked with him at AAA and he had good numbers) can get something out of him. I hate to give up on cheap lefty pitchers when we need one bad.

My over simplified take on the bullpen is throw strikes - it is draining watching, Farnswork and friends throw first and second pitch balls. I don't care who they are, or what they pitch, if they get beat, they should get beat by giving up hits.

The pen was a key part of the Yankees run in the late 90s and has not fully been addressed since the days of Stanton and Nelson. With a young starting staff, solidifying the pen is a top priority.

Steve O,
Agreed, very much so.

I liked Veras at times last year, Britton as well but not much besides that (well, Mo and Joba of course) there wasn't much to be happy about. Maybe Proctor will want to get the heck out of Dodgertown now that Joe T. is there?
I liked Ohlendorf and I have high hopes for Sanchez when he's healthy and wouldn't mind seeing the Yanks pick up Mahay, but not at a high cost.
The new guy, Albaladejo sounds like he might be decent, at least he's supposed to be able to throw strikes.

Igawa, or as I called him last year "Ughawa" is someone I just don't have high hopes for. Something bothers me about him and I just don't think he's going to work out. He wasn't even much to speak of when he was in Japan and now with the bigger ball in MLB, I just don't see him having any success. I'd trade him.

guess we ae over santana - one last thought for me

if this was about getting younge and cutting payoll than why did we justggive a combined 100 million to guys who will be near 40 at the deals end.

If Cash wants to ebuild and go with youth he should have had the guts to let Posada and Mo walk - i almost would have rathered that scenaio - at least the team would show some direction

Sometimes its the deals you dont make that are impotant, but sometimes the deals you dont mamke set the fanchise back fo years - 28 yea old Ace for a could be and a bunch of neve wills - You have to do that deal

The Twins want Hughes and the Yanks other pospects - I believe they went back to the Yanks with a lesser offer and I believe that is the reason why they are delaying a deal they supposedly wanted to get done before the winter meetings.'

If the Sox land Santana than any other team is going to ake the Yanks ver the coals fo pospects. Beane will want more fo Haren, the Orioles wont trade Bedard in the division without being \blown away and Kazmir isnt goling anywhere because the Rays finally look like they are becoming a team to be eckoned with

Drew & Mike from Jersey: Posted something more on IPK on the last thread.

Bullpen ideas: I can see the Yanks having to place heavier than usual reliance on some parts of bullpen this year. I think what we'll see is some rotating of parts between SWB & the Yanks pen. It won't even be whether they're successful, but whether they need some rest. There will be at least one or two of the kids that become part of the core of the pen. There will be about 4 that become interchangeable throughout the year due to rest concerns. There will be one guy that comes through and is almost as clutch as Joba last year. The surprise guy is David Robertson. He was great last year; pitched the end of the season at Trenton and will probably start there this year, but I can see him making a big push into SWB early in the year and the Yanks by August or September.

My opening day pen:

Rivera
Farnsworth
Abalejo (spelt wrong, I know)
Britton
Patterson (the 28 year old)
Ohlendorf
Veras or Edwar (I really don't like either)

Chris, I really think Cash never wanted to trade Hughes in the 1st place. If the Twins wanted to trade for Ian and a bunch of minor leaguers, he would have pulled the trigger. I think the more he though about losing Phil and having the replace Melkey in CF (AKA Noodle Arm Damon back in CF) was weighing on him. I dont think it had anything to do with the money. The Yanks threw their hat in the ring, but I dont think they wanted to move the young pieces they worked so hard to obtain and develop. They would never say this, but they are hoping that the Twins keep Johan and then the Yanks can go after him next year. If he goes to the Sox, so be it, that’s the risk we are taking.

Gotta run so I won’t be able to respond until tomorrow. Later..

I have to say I have little interest in seeing either Edwar or Igawa stand up in pinstripes again.

They both strike me as FLIMSY.

Flimsy pitchers should only be seen on NL mounds.

FLIM-zee

Lacking in substance, likely to bend or break under pressure.

The antithesis of solid.

According to Sherman, Yankee officials are saying that one of the reaons they didnt do the Santana deal is that it would have made their payroll too high.

If true, that would be one of the worst jobs of managing a roster I can remember, IF the Yankees couldnt afford to have their payroll go too high why did they resign Abreu (admittingly a nice player, but not Santana)?

Plus, $80 million comes off the payroll next year, couldnt they have taken the (1 year) hit?

If the Red Sox get Santana, the Yankees really aren't going to be able to compete, so what in the world was the logic in spending close to 100 million on two guys (Rivera and Posada) who in 2 or three years when the Yankees might be able to compete with the Sox again, won't be effective anymore. It just doesnt make sense on any, really any, level.

If the Yankees couldnt go higher in their payroll, why did they do the moves they made?

The Yankees will compete just fine next season whether Santana goes to the Red Sox or not.

How soon we forget that this team won 92 games last season despite seven talentless scrubs making 36 starts (which was 22% of their 162 regular season games):

Matt DeSalvo, Tyler Clippard, Kei Igawa, Sean Henn, Chase Wright, Jeff Karstens, and Darrell Rasner

Moving Joba to the rotation and getting full seasons out of Hughes and Kennedy - with Alan Horne getting his shot as well - is going to make this rotation significantly better be default.

Are these kids going to experience growing pains?

Certainly. But they can't possibly do worse than the aforementioned rag arm squad.

Agree with you 100% Viper, if anything the biggest problem was having Pavano penciled in the starting rotation beginning of last season. I don't think Santana was about the money, it's NEVER been about the money for them. Cashman never wanted to give up Hughes.

I think for Cashman, Hughes reflects the Yanks fundamental change in mindset to grow their farm system instead of trading them at the slightest sign of panic from George or Yankee fans when the Red Sox made a move. In recent history how many bad deals did we make in order to counter the Sox? Way way too many. It's time to stop going down that road.

From what I've seen of Hughes last season I'm willing to give him a shot.

Damaso Marte would be a great move for the Yanksters.

Wouldn't rule out the possibility of Santana as Opening Day starter for the '08 Yanks...This thing ain't o'er yet.

I think sentimentality had a lot to do with the re-signing of Posada and Mo, along with the fact they can still perform at or above the level of the best of their peers. The old warriors will open up the new Stadium and gracefully exit into the sunset of overpampered and overpaid athletes. By that time, somebody named Montero will be the beast behind the plate.

Farnsworth will not be a Yankee by Opening Day - all those kind words by Girardi were just to amp his value to potential suitors.

And that's the way it 'tis and gonna be,
Sevrox

Ron Mahay was rumored to be close to signing with NY around Thanksgiving...nothing since. Imo , he would fit in nicely as a setup man from the leftside and could close if needed....though not much.

Igawa should be given every chance to prove he can't pitch in the majors by sticking him in the pen as a long reliever...jmo. If he fails , nothing new , if not they may have something. He's a lefty as well.

I believe Ohlendorph(sp??) has the goods to contribute in mid relief or possibly start in a pinch.

Sanchez is a darkhorse , due to his injury but one that may pleasantly suprise....NY needs that to happen.

Farnsy???? If Joe can turn him around I am all for it. He has nasty stuff when he is on....when he is on ;-)

Marte I know little about as well as the new kid ....there is always room for a good arm in the pen. I also saw where someone mentioned Chase Wright. I had read that he doesn't have the stuff to be a solid starter on the ML level. So they may try and use him as a reliever from the left side. So who knows?

Ohlendorf...lol , I really butchered the spelling of that!

I forgot Patterson , he put up some fine numbers last season and was protected from the rule 5 draft...so he is a possibility?

Lastly , let me clarify my statement regarding Igawa. If he can't cut it as a starter and it appears he can't......moving him to the pen may work in NY's favor? If not , nothing lost on trying if there isn't a better solution from the left side.

Well a little something on NY's interest in Mahay and some inhouse possibilities...

http://mvn.com/mlb-yankees/2007/12/06/yankees-pitching-wrap-up/

Marte' would be a nice addition. As far as Sanatana, from what I am reading between the lines, Cashman is saying said it was the cost of HUGHES and the money that made the trade too expensive. Perhaps if the Twins would take just Kennedy and those prosepects, money suddenly is not an issue.

Viper I agree with your post ,

But lets be honest if this years team falls under the same start as last years squad do you really think they can climb out of the Hole? This played part in the early exit of the Playoff's this team was exhaustedfor having to basically fight just to make it.

I have confidence to a degree with the kids but also have realistic views that tells me just in case be prepared for disaster.

People speak on Hughes post season game. In that same breath I would bring up Russ O. post season game when he got bombed and you want to put him in the pen???

Andrew Jones just signed for TWO YEARS - 36million!!! did we even inquire about his services???

The more I read into this I believe the wrong man was given the exit door.

While we may have stock piled our farm at one point some of them have to be traded for some value .

With his options dwindling Andruw Jones has signed with the Dodgers for 36mm over two years. Deal includes 12mm signing bonus. Looks like teams are not interested in super agent Boras FA.

the Yankees should have kicked the Tires if that number was on the table , then they could have signed dude and traded BOBBY A for some high caliber prospects (possibly to the Dodgers)

Swiping a link from Pete Abraham's blog again, here's Joba giving back at home in Nebraska. They say a number of players who have been through that local program have said that someday when they make it they will help it along, but usually they forget. Not Joba, apparently, who appeared at their fundraiser and who, along with his family, is giving a scoreboard. Pictures with the story.

http://www.beatricedailysun.com/articles/2007/12/04/sports/local/doc475577834f9c1543766903.txt

Bomber,

You’ll recall the Yanks fell into such a hole last season because the rotation was decimated by injuries (Wang, Pavano, and Moose) and the club needed several members of the aforementioned “rag arm squad” to replace them.

I guess it's possible that such an occurrence could happen again in 2008, but it's unlikely.

That's a poor argument comparing Ohlendorf and Hughes in the postseason.

For one thing, Hughes has been the #1 prospect in the Yankee farm system (and MLB in 2007) for three years and has shown he can get hitters out. He was getting the drive back into his legs that he lost as a result of his hammy tear and it made a big difference in September and October.

Ohlendorf made just a handful of appearances for the Yanks before making the postseason roster. The comparison is apples and oranges.

If we diminished everyone who had a bad ALDS, we'd be taking 90% of the postseason roster to the woodshed for the exception of Cano, Pettitte, Mo, Joba, and Damon.

A bad postseason doesn't mean they can't do the job next year. I know Ohlendorf went to the AFL to learn a splitter so that he would have another "swing and miss" pitch. Obviously, Cashman and Co. feel that he is going to get a legit shot to make a difference in that pen.

The key to building a bullpen now is to use failed starters who throw hard and throw strikes. Overspending on marginal veterans on the FA market is a gamble because you’re often stuck with them (ie: Farnsworth) if they don’t pan out and their production will probably be the same.

At least the team can move the minor leaguers to and from Scranton if they fail to do the job. Right now, they don’t have much of a choice.

I’m really looking forward to seeing Sanchez and Melancon get their chances late in the season.

Sigh ...

The moves and non moves are as usual just horrendous.

Last year it was counting on Pavano.

It was Igawa for 46 million plus his salary for one win

It was Igawa for 1 win at 50 million plus instead of Lilly's 15 wins for 10 million. (He didn't miss any starts I don't think and managed not to beat up his coach for once!).

It was no backup catcher till June.

It was assembling a line of streaky, injury prone guys we can't count on, maybe for a month at a time: Matsui, Damon, Moose, Giambi, Clemens.

Did I say Farnsworth and Meyers?

This year it's ...

Over bidding by 100 million for A Rod after the high school drama episode.

Contracts for Mo and Jorge and A Rod into their 40s.

No lefties in the pen. (Stanton, Graham Lloyd, Jiimmy Key, Wells ... where is that caliber?)

Not drafting good lefties unless you count Henn and Chase 4 HR Wright.

Drafting only good righty hurlers: very good job there! But we need balance! You can'f find LHP's at Arizona State, Miami U., Cape
Cod or Alaska Leagues, inner city, outer city, Australia? The best the great Yankees can do is Igawa? This is a joke, right?

Still about 25 percent of the roster is almost totally wasted. Not as bad as last year.

No bullpen: Losing out on Troy Percival!

Signing Abreu as Bronx Bomber pointed out. Nothing against Abreu but for 16 million?

The national and global economic forecast does not look good. The team is very rich but still they should have tightened the belt.

Now Detroit, the Angels, Boston and the Indians all look as good or better.

Toronto may have the best 5 starters ...

Jesse
Marcum
McGowan
AJ
Oh, and what's his name? Halladay

Cashman would never keep his job in any other field making so many mistakes. (Brown, Vasquez, Giambi, Igawa, Irabu ...) Theo beat him in every way. They got Becket over Pavanon, Schilling over Vasquez, Oki and Mice K over Igawa and Irabu. That's the major difference between the two teams.

Bring back Bob Watson.

Still next year should be a lot of fun, as it always is!

There are lots of positives.

But again, until you look at the Yankees roster and say, like the New England Patriots, that EVERY guy is good and there for a reason, then we won't get near the World Series.

Most equity, most payroll should mean the best team.

We don't have that and that just can't be.

The New England Patriots don't waste 10 spots (in comparison) on their roster.

If you want to be great you can't do things half assed.

Sorry ...

It's nice to have all the optimism around the few young pitchers who show any signs of turning into front-of-the-rotation arms, but a team needs a lot of other pitchers besides the two or three at the front of the starting rotation. Will the Yankees be able to develop some of that surge of young pitching into a commodity we desperately need, talented and reliable relievers? The guys who have good stuff but only a couple of strong pitches need to be carefully cultivated into a stream of relief pitchers -- because without that, the nicely growing stream of starters is just going to end up handing over leads that vanish.

BB, no way I swap in Jones for Abreu, even taking defense into consideration. You're talking about swapping a #3 high AVG/OBA guy for a low AVG./K-per-game rally killer who might slot into the 6 hole in the Yanks line-up.

Thats is not an argument Viper it is a fact many EXPERTS on here including myself protected and used Hughes one playoff game as a sign of greatness while in the same breath many on here penciled in Russ into the pen even after his disgusting playoff game. The point made here is we can positivly evaluate Hughes One game and state it was a sign of greatness whiel write off Russ's game as just a bad outing. and still pencil him in a crucial role of the Pen. Maybe Sanchez can be a better starter who knows

IF and IF the Yankees fall in the same mess as they did last year then the road to recover is harder .

The only way I do not see a upmost collaspe is due to the fact that scouting reports on the three is not 100%

After all the previous moaning about thrift I thought Anthony would be thrilled that the Yankees DIDN'T spend those millions!

I guess a high school drama queen can always find a reason to sigh ...

Joba is very special. Noticed in that link Diane that he rights with his left hand. Ahhh, it's a fel good story. Can't wait for him to be our ACE!!!

BB: I know Abreu's gone after next year, but with the kids coming up, why fill up a salary & roster spot with a bat/contract like Jones'? The # of pitches Abreu takes in the 3 slot alone is worth keeping him for another year, just to let him rub off on Cano and Melky some more.

Hey haven't been by for a while. Too busy celebrating the 2nd World Series in 4 years. What a GREAT time up here in Boston we are having during the holiday season. All the World Series items are flying off the shelves for xmas!

Still nice to see the same Yankee winners like Hughes Your Daddy and Viper are still here spewing their dribble about the over-achieving Yankees.

You guys look good down there in second place.........get use to it!

Dave, I saw that too, interesting picture, huh?

Noticed in the quotes he said of the local appearance, "This is not something I was forced to do."

Implication being that some of these other appearances are team demands.

Well, he's young, he'll soon learn what he can and can't say. In the meantime the spontaneity is refreshing.

Marianne, divas will be divas.

On Joba: Buster had a fun piece on ESPN.com on him about texting. The kid is a texting freak!

Relievers: someone mentioned Ramirez. That first inning he pitched was special, but again, I'm worried about what happens to him second time around the league. There aren't too many big leaguers who don't turn into Roy Hobson when they're sitting on a change-up.

Jim A. did I see you post that you get reception on the FAN in Herndon?

By the way, r.e. my recent (informal) survey of nyc newspaper Yankee blogs: I like Mark Feinsand, but his last two posts from Nashville were about a cookie and a trade show. Don't know how Kat keeps up.

I think every Yankee fan should send a thank you note to the Detroit Tigers. The package they gave to the Marlins for Willis and Cabrera is the reason why the Twins are now considering keeping Johan Santana. The Marlins got 2 of the best prospects in baseball for an average pitcher and a great hitter (with plenty of issues). Upon seeing that the Twins know they deserve better than Jon Lester and Coco Crisp for Santana and are going to hold out to get that.

My theory is that now that the Dodgers have signed Andruw Jones, and already have Juan Pierre and Andre Eithier, LA will put together a package of Clayton Kershaw, Matt Kemp, Andy LaRoche and maybe even Brad Penny for Santana.

DC,

Pete Abraham is a blogging fiend with a constant stream of updates, some interesting and some trivial. His blog has the highest volume of traffic that I know of locally and he has zero tolerance for trolls -- they get banned quickly. But the level of discussion by his commenters is not nearly as high as the volume, which is a ton of (mostly good-natured) stuff to wade through for not many nuggets. I read HIS stuff but nowadays usually skip the hundreds of responses that he always seems to get.

Hey, thanks, Diane.

Rule 5 draft today folks, could this be the day that the Yankees and the long discussed Eric Duncan part ways?

Boston Globe reports that negotiations between Red Sox and Twins for what's his name are over. I believe that as much as I believe the Yanks will put Igawa in the starting rotation.

CHIP-
Forget thanking other teams. The Yanks have the "money" and "young talent" to take care of themselves. The "08" season will be all about money\team payroll. That is now the top priority. The Santana "pass" was all about the dough. No coincidence the Yanks issued their "No Mas", a day after Pettitte decided to collect his $16 million in "08". And now the Yanks are claiming Vizcaino is asking for too much money. A franchise worth over 1 $Billion dollars claiming a "set up" guy is asking for too much money. This sounds more like Tampa Bay, not the Yanks. The "squeeking" is deafening.

Vizcaino IS asking for too much money for a guy who, frankly, was not all that good last year. He had a good month but certainly not good enough to warrant a 4yr/$20M contract.

I know they didn't always impress us but I have to say I enjoyed the panorama of youth that we saw during the dark days of last season when the majority of our starters were injured and we were throwing kids in there three days out of five.

I look forward to the ongoing saga of pinstripe babies in the coming season. I think there must be lots of fans like me who follow the kids with interest and hope for them to succeed.

I remember the first time I saw Jeter when he was a kind of skinny kid with a mischievous grin. Mariano always serious and stoic from the beginning. Posada fiery and pushy. Andy with that hypnotic stare from behind his upheld glove. All those young faces stay with me and make me wonder what I will remember, a decade from now, of the young faces of today.

Marianne,
It's funny to look back at some of the old games on TV and to see just how young those guys looked. The baby faces of Jeter and Pettitte really stand out the most to me. They didn't look like they could get into R-rated movies.

Two names that stuck out on the Rule 5 draft:

Ray Liotta (any relation?) and Smelin Perez. This poor kid probably never caught a break in school. He probably got to be an athlete because he had to sprint home from school every day, what were his parents thinking. Are their names Tastin and Eatin?

Otherwise...nothing to speak of in the draft.

The stories about Jeter calling his parents every night. It was the Joba story without the material hardships -- clean-cut young kid handling early-career struggles with help of supportive family.

Bomber,

Andruw Jones wanted to play for a team in a warm climate. That was 1 reason that the Yanks didn't go after him.

In those days when Jeter was asked about forbidden substances he said something like, "Are you kidding, my dad would kill me."

I remember blogging here in those desperate days early in the season that if the kid on the mound was as young as he looked I had scarves older than our starting pitcher.

It may have been Chase Wright, who looked 12 at the time...

Odd to be looking back at that gut-churning period with nostalgia.

I hope the coming season will be memorable in a completely different way!

A couple of notes:

First, the Yankees will likely release Pavano today to clear a spot on the 40 man roster.

Second, the Giants have inquired about Hideki Matsui (who has a full no trade clause but might waive it) The Giants and Jays are stalled in discussions about Alex Rios for Matt Cain or Tim Lincecum.

It appears as though the Yankees passed on taking any players but did lose one, RHP Mike Gardner.

I would like to address Edwar Ramirez as I see many on this thread are down on him. I dont think we're giving the kid a fair shake. Check out his stats since he came back from an injury in 04.

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/R/edwar-ramirez.shtml

He has been absolutely dominate! Look at that K rate and WHIP!! OUTSTANDING!! He won the minor league RP of the year award in 07. The reason he got into trouble when he hit the bigs was not his changeup, it was because he couldnt locate his fastball. If you are a changeup/fastball pitcher, you better dam well get that fastball over for strikes or your changeup is gonna get hammered. I think it was the jitters more than anything. I believe the combo of Girardi, Dave Eiland (who worked with Edwar at AAA), Posada and Molina is gonna be great for these young pitchers. Dont be surprised if Edwar is a solid 7th or 8th inning guy. The minor league numbers dont lie, he's got talent. Lets see if he can put it together in the bigs.

Also, former Yankee infield prospect Andy Canizerro was signed by the Rays. With the addition of Alberto Gonzalez and the presence of guys like A-Rod, Jeter, and Cano there was really no spot for Andy to break in here.

Yankees are said to be looking at a trade for Damaso Marte or Mike Grabow (both LHP from the Pirates) and also at possibly signing LaTroy Hawkins.

Chip,

If the Giants are interested in Rodzilla, who are they offering?

I like the idea of beefing up the pen. If it becomes a reliable weapon, then the # of innings pitched won't become an issue with Chamberlain, Hughes and Kennedy.

Looks like the bullpen is going to be totally revamped. Good.
HYD, who is this guy Robertson? Have any stats on 'em? I am liking the candidates for the "new" pen a lot:

Sanchez
White
Melancon
Patterson
Marte
Whelan
Veras
Ohlendorf
Farnsworth
These guys have upscale stuff. Looks like the Tigers line-up will be right-hand heavy, so power pitching righties in our pen could match-up very well. I hope.

DC -

I would because the trade value of Bobby A would have increased in search of positional PROSPECTS like i said the dogers would have jump on it, and they have high level positional players.

Jones would have been that lethal RH bat. and please do not give Bobby A all that mush credit his 1st half was disgusting.

the goal should have been to tool your team for a better tomorrow. and while protecting the pitching prospects attention could have been aimed at building positional prospects.
Since you have your catcher and closer , 3b locked up until they get SS checks the open spots should have been explored with suitable replacements either with age or defensive abilities

I would evaluate the Giants situation regarding Matsui. what is hideki;s numbers compared to Rios and could the team get a lincaum if they throw in a Minor l. ?

Edwar had his highly vocal defenders here last season who claimed that every problem he had was because Torre didn't pitch him often enough when he first came up. In the turmoil of young pitchers he got skipped for twelve days early on, and some of his supporters seemed to believe that his entire season fell apart for this reason. Good enough to explain a couple of bad outings but it seemed a pretty flimsy analysis to me, for a whole season of unpredictable, unreliable outings.

Worse yet if it was true. A guy that was really so delicate would have no place in a Yankee Stadium bullpen.

I had high hopes for him on the basis of his minor league stats but those turn meaningless pretty quickly once a pitcher is facing big league hitters.

Nothing wrong with giving him another chance in ST but I don't see how we can completely discount his major league record so far.

BB: I know Abreu's gone after next year, but with the kids coming up, why fill up a salary & roster spot with a bat/contract like Jones'? The # of pitches Abreu takes in the 3 slot alone is worth keeping him for another year, just to let him rub off on Cano and Melky some more.
===============================================

DC,

The kids are not showing up for another two years.

at 36 million his money would have been just a little over Bobby's yearly that would have made Bobby A , tradeable.

on another note I would call detroit RIGHT now and say here is Kyle and Chase wright for Dontrell Willis

Diane I agree with what you're saying, but 21 innings of MLB experience is not that large of a sample size to pass judgement. You will notice that his K rate was still excellent ( 21in - 31K's ). He gets a lot of swings and misses with that change.

Remember it's real easy for us to sit back and say that the kid's too delicate, but baseball is a game won and lost in your head. If you are used every other day for 2 years, then you ride the pine for almost two weeks, that has a profound affect on a pitchers control and psyche. Torre was terrible at managing that aspect of the game. I think we should not just throw away those dominate minor league stats. We need to give his guys a fair shot and then pass judgement. I think he's gonna surprise people this year.

FYI...I'm terrible at tie-pinggggggg...lol

John G.

The report didn't indicate who the Yankees would get back if Matsui were dealt to the Giants. I assume that it would be less than Cain or Lincecum given Matsui's physical limitations and contract.

If the Yankees could get back for him a prospect like Jonathan Sanchez (LHP) and either a fourth outfielder like Dave Roberts - that would be pretty good.

Drew,

I hope you are right about Edwar and I will be rooting for him and hoping he lives up to the promise of his MiLB days. But I am less optimistic than I was when he first came up. And I can't blame Torre for not relying on the Edwar that showed up last year, at a time when there was really no slack to wait around while someone pulled his psyche together. Torre would have been crucified for taking many or long chances on Edwar as he was then. Hopefully it will be a very long time before Yankee pitching is in such desperate straits again, and our situation will be one in which even the delicate flowers will get some opportunity to bloom. And we can also hope that the shock is over for Edwar and he will feel calmer this time around. It will be hard to forget seeing him visibly shaking on the mound to the point that Rodriguez came over to hold him.

You don't win a championship with a team loaded with "young" untested pitchers. The Yankee rotation is full of em, and likewise the bullpen. The Yanks don't even have a legitimate "Ace" to anchor this young starting staff. The best way to fortify both the rotation and the "pen", would have been to get Santana, and use Chamberlain as the "bridge" to MO. The Yanks have all these pitching question marks, yet are close to DOA at the Winter Meetings. This Blog currently reflects the same comatose condition. Wake up people. You are waxing about rookies\young players as if you were fans of the KC Royals. A little bit of salt makes a meal more enjoyable. A lot of it results in spoiling both the meal and "turning" your stomach. This team and your stomach are on a collision course.

It reminded me of the time that Byung Yung Kim physically collapsed on the mound when pitching against the Yankees.

I can't take pleasure in a sight like that even when it is an opponent.

No, Roy, we are going on like people who well remember when Jeter, Mariano, Posad, Pettite and Bernie were all young and untested Yankees.

Perhaps not everyone here has been around long enough to remember that such hopes can be rewarded.

You're right Roy, guess we should concede the season now. When do NFL training camps open again?