Looks like there was no real reason to fret over the Yankees getting Mike Cameron and forgetting about Melky Cabrera. Cameron agreed to terms with the Brewers yesterday.
One wonders whether he ever had significant interest in playing for the Yankees, or if they were just the team that helped drive the price up for Milwaukee. In any case, at this point, it appears the Yankees team looks about like it will when spring training starts (which, incidentally, is awfully close to what it looked like when the season ended plus LaTroy Hawkins and minus Luis Vizcaino and Doug Mientkiewicz). The only way that is likely to change is if they finally get Johan Santana. I'm not including the possibility of a minor addition a la Jason Lane, which, let's face it, won't excite many fans.
So if this is your 2008 Yankees team, how do you feel about that?
Comments (22)
You are neglecting one MAJOR change - Joe Girardi. By his presence alone I think you can bet the house that the Donut Club(Fatties Damon, Abreu, Melky, Cano) will not be making another appearance. I know, they didn't look like Terry Forster, but they all clearly came to Major League Camp out of shape, and the fact that NYY finished 2 games behind the team that marched to the World Series Trophy, their country club attittude sticks in my craw.
Regarding the 2008 Yankees player moves. First, I have no problem with the "overpayment" given to Arod - although I think they should've gotten him for less because he walked, you don't bite your nose to spite your face..
That said, for them to nickel and dime the bullpen, by replacing Luis Vizcaino with another Farnsworth(LaTroy Hawkins), is egregiously questionable. Adding insult to injury, Junior Delicate Genius Cashman tells us on YES that Farsnworth is set as the Set up Man. Senior Delicate Genius Torre's affinity for Vile Kyle apparently is still punishing us. Do the Georges(Hank and Hal) actually think that you can win a WS with Kyle Farsnworth as your set up man? Its insulting.
Thank you for not mentioning Jason Lane - the fact that this received more than an AP line item is also insulting.
Didn't mean to neglect the change in manager. Obviously that will be a huge difference, whether good or bad or some of each. I was simply focused on player change. Coaching changes will be significant too.
You can say what you want BUT the bullpen will be a mess without Joba and a lefty thats worth anything!!
I don't think Melky and Cano were in bad shape when the season started last year. I just think they just struggled.
I've never been a huge Melky fan anyways because he's a guy with a great arm but not a good defensive outfielder. He doesn't track the ball well but makes up for it with his speed.
Truthfully, Damon is still the better outfielder but he gets a ton of slack because of his arm.
Also, Damon and Abreu were in bad shape but Abreu had that ribcage injury that slowed him down a bit.
Joba absolutely needs to be in the rotation - and the Yankee brass wholeheartedly agrees.
I'm really excited about this coming year. I loved Torre and especially Gator but I think Girardi and Eiland, with Pena's help, are the right men to lead this. The influx of youth was too long in coming. We're very good at several positions and at the others, we have depth. In the depth there is someone with great potential. The depth will bring about competition. The competition will bring out the best in the competitors. Someone good will emerge. The best will play. This is better than handing someone a job and expecting him to live up to expectations with only self motivation. This might be the best Yankee team of the last 50 years. They might not show it all this year but the foundation is being layed. I don't like all the negativity and pessimism associated with certain players, the bullpen, etc. I don't see how it helps the team win. It's all speculation at this point and if this is the team, then I'm all for it. Lets go get'm. Every team has issues, we're just as good as anyone. I think we're better.
Yes, the team is basicly the smae with lateral improvement ar best but I feel more confident with the starters being younger and giving us some steady improvement during the season. I applaud the Yankees for their ability to stay the course ( Oh no that phrase again) with the youth influence from within.
The issue of injuries will be the difference this year. We'll probably have a 6man rotation sort of with the best standing pitching in the playoffs.
Peter LaCock, best Yankee team of the last 50 years?
Better than 1961? Better than 1977? Better than 1998?
Friends, now THAT is an optimistic fan!
Damon LF
Jeter SS
Abreu RF
Rodriguiz 3RD
Matsui/Giambi DH
Posada C
Cano 2ND
Duncan 1ST
Cabrera CF
Wang SP
Pettitite SP
Chamberlain SP
Hughes SP
Kennedy Sp
Mussina SP
I would be very happy with the above lineup, but would like to see a decent left hander or two in the bullpen. The apparent 'let's not panic because we've exited the playoffs early for the past few years' approach is definitely the way to proceed. With the Yankees financial resources, the temptation to buy a quick fix will always be a phone call away but I'm really pleased that they are heading in their current direction. We have some good prospects and now, with a new manager, there will be genuine competition for spots and day to day playing opportunities. And if the above lineup changes, I see that as a good thing if it is a result of competition for the spot. I'm really looking forward to spring training.
I'm pretty content with the team as is. Im not really sure there were any smart moves out there for Cashman to make, so coming home with the payroll and list of prospects intact made sense.
They could have made some additional moves like getting a Tony Clark type for first or some additional options in the pen, but overall I think its a solid team.
Regarding starting pitching, it seems as if we wont be getting Santana (until 2009 perhaps?) so alot is riding on Mussina, Hughes and Kennedy being solid. As the season progresses it will be interesting to see how that unfolds.
Close to 1 month till pitchers and catchers!
Manager is clearly an upgrade!!! Team is basically the same so I don't really see # 27 happening in 2008. Bullpen is still a waste land and the SP'ing is very, very thin. The Yanks are obviously going to limit the IP for the kiddie corps of starters. So, IF we make it to the playoffs, who's going to pitch for us since Hughes, Joba, and Kennedy will already have been maxed out in IP???? I'm not very excited about what I'm seeing for 2008.
Rick,
With the exception of the manager being an upgrade (I'm not sold on that yet, but am open minded), I agree 100% with you.
Too many if's in 2008, such as Yanks will win IF:
a. The kids all perform the way we hope.
b. The kids stay healthy
c. The kids don't max out their innings too early
d. The bullpen performs a lot better than they look right now
e. A-Rod and Posada have similar seasons to 2007
f. Giambi can give the team some production
g. Damon, Abreu and Cano get off to better starts than last season
h. Defense at first base isn't disastrous
i. Shelley Duncan can provide some RH pop
That's just a few things to worry about, but that's me, I'm a worry wart type of fan.
h.
Well, Rick.
If you're not very excited about this upcoming season, perhaps you should refrain from watching the games.
The starting pitching will be better. Only two games separated the Yanks and Red Sox in 2007 and the Yanks had the huge disadvantage of running DeSalvo, Clippard, Henn, Igawa, Wright, Karstens, and Rasner out there for 36 starts - not to mention the rash of injuries in April and May.
It's not exactly a reach to suggest that the talented kids like Kennedy, Joba, and Hughes (with Horne on that way) will perform better than the aforementioned rag-tag bunch.
These kids don't have to be spectacular to be an effective core. Being merely average is a significant upgrade and they should get plenty of run support.
I'm with ya Viper, Lil Jimmy Nordon, Aussie Gary & Larry M.
There's something to be said for continuity & cohesiveness.
Some people (Jim A., Rick, Mike FL, Johnnystorm) see the glass half empty. They have valid concerns and I would add my own biggest worry to their lists; Will the HGH scrutiny & criticism affect Andy Pettitte?
I see the best player in the game surrounded by some other very good players with the only questionable areas being 1B-DH-LF and those positions addressed with competition and depth and in that depth is the potential of former all-stars and hungry youth. We have a good utility man that can hit and we even have a good backup catcher.
People make too much of the lefty in the bullpen role. It's the least important role to fill. Nevertheless lefties Henn, Igawa and a few others will compete for a spot in the pen. I'd rather just have good pitchers and I like the approach this year. There wasn't much out there and we didn't reach too much other than Hawkins. The young guys will push the veterans and again, let the best men win. Just because Igawa sucked as a starter doesn't necessarily mean he sucks. He had some success relieving last year. Maybe he can be an Ortiz killer. Chase Wright is a lefty that will get a chance to show his stuff. Veras & Ohlendorf looked good to me and I'm intrigued with Jonathan Albaladejo. Farnsworth has stunk but his contract is up (I love that) and he throws 100 mph (you can't teach that). I love Gator but I think Eiland is better and I want to see what he can do with Farnsworth. And let's not forget about Joba. He fixes everything. Starter, set up, closer, he can do it all. I think we can all agree that at least we know he can do the latter two. I think it's interesting that NYY management has not completely committed to his starting this year. He certainly would answer a lot of questions with the bullpen and have Mo as a mentor. I have no problem with Hughes, Wang, Pettitte, Mussina & Kennedy as the starters. I hear Karstens is working hard this offseason.
Jim A. often points out that odds are everything isn't going to work out. I have always agreed. I'll go a step further and say usually most things don't work out. But in this case, there are so many awfully good looking prospects, some of them have to pan out and maybe, just maybe this will be that really special group that comes along once in a lifetime.Thankfully, we've held on to them so we can see.
Sully, I take back what I said. This might be the best Yankee team EVER. They might not show it all this year but the foundation is being layed.
For another opinion on Hughes check this out:
http://www.aarongleeman.com/2008_01_06_baseballblog_archive.html#4376546875210444466
I couldn't have said it better myself.
That one didn't post right. Here it is again in two parts:
http://www.aarongleeman.com/2008_01_06_baseball
blog_archive.html#4376546875210444466
Im with Viper and Peter on this one. People complain about the Yanks not picking up anyone significant this offseason, Im not. The Yanks ended up scoring almost a thousand runs this past season. They did that after starting the season off so miserably. Cano, Matsui, Abreu, Damon were all in major slumps, yet still we led the league in runs. Add in the following =
Abreu is in a contract year. He hired a personal trainer this offseason for the 1st time in his career. I expect Bobby to be VERY motivated and in the best shape of his life. He will end up being much better than last year.
Giambi is in a contract year. He didnt have to rehab any injuries this offseason, he can just work on getting in shape. He will be VERY motivated and in better shape than hes been in a years.
Damon will be fresh by splitting time in left and at DH, you all saw how that worked out at the end of last year.
Cano will be fresh and will only improve on his dominate 2nd half numbers. Yankee fans will see that Robbie will get better and better until he is the #3 hitter in the lineup ( was his entire minor league career ), if he can improve on his eye, he will be a stud!
Melk's numbers will improve due to his maturing another year.
Wilson will provide much needed switch hitting power off the bench for the entire year. He has a solid glove so we can have a nice rotation of him giving a day off to any of our INF’s while still keeping pop in the lineup.
Shelly will provide a solid power RH bat off the bench, he had 7 HR’s in only 74 AB’s, do that math over 500 AB’s and you can see what kind of power potential the kid has. Hopefully he takes the 1B job in ST, he would be Ritchie Sexson for the price of Miguel Cairo. Give Shelly 500 AB’s and he can jack 35-40 or more HR’s, another power RH bat in the lineup to give balance..imagine that in the #8 hole!
I don’t see Arod or Jorge duplicating their numbers this year, but they wont be that far off either. The above players will more than offset any drop in production they experience. The Yanks could be the 1st team to score 1000 runs since the Indians of the 97 season. What did we need to improve on there?
OK now to the part of the team everyone bashes, the pitching.
As Viper has pointed out a Zillion times on this blog, we had the Trenton team starting for the 1st 6 weeks of the season. We actually set a MLB all time record for most SP’s used in the 1st 2 months of the season. The kids, along with Wang not getting injured like he did in the beginning of 07, will bring great stability to the rotation. People complain about the innings caps of the three kids. Lets examine =
Wang should go for 210-230
Andy should go for 200-220
Ian should go for 180-200
Phil should go for 160-180
Joba should go for 160-180
If needed we have Moose who could go for 200 if needed.
Listen, not everyone in the rotation needs to go for 200+ innings. Your #4 and #5 starters don’t go for 200 innings. No team in the league had a #4 or #5 starter go for that many. For an example, lets look at the Sox who had a rock steady rotation that didn’t really experience any major injuries. What were their innings last year?
Dice K = 204
Beckett = 200
Wakefield = 189
Schilling = 151
Tavarez = 134
Lester = 63
Bucholtz = 22
Those were the only 7 SP’s that registered a GS for the Sox.
What about the Indians?
CC = 241
Carmona = 215
Byrd = 192
Westbrook = 152
Lee = 97
Sowers = 67
Laffey = 49
Again, 7 SP’s, only two exceeded 200 innings. Pitchers miss starts all the time, sometimes a week, sometimes a month, it happens. It will happen to the yanks this year. That’s why having Moose and a young stud like Alan Horne is so important. You need to have great pitching depth over the course of a season. I think we are blowing the innings cap of the three kids out of proportion. Wang, Andy, Moose or Ian…could all approach the 200 innings mark..thats all you need. The #4 and #5 starters will only need about 170 innings, which both Joba and Phil could reach.
So where does that leave our pitching staff? It leaves it in great shape, a light year ahead of last season when we started “some guy” on opening day, a name which I will never repeat again.
The next complaint is about the Bullpen…
Mo ( still top 5 closer in the entire league )
Farny ( Joe Girardi worked with him in Chicago and feels very confident that he can get him back on track )
Hawk ( not a great bullpen guy, but a solid vet contributor who could end up being decent for us in the 7th )
Then the kids…
Ohlendorf
Veras
Albaladejo
Britton
Bruney
Igawa
Chase Wright
Henn
Karstens
Edwar ( minor league RP of the year in 07, even though he struggled in 07, he still struck out 31 over 21in )
Then over the course of the year the TJ boys will get healthy…Sanchez, Melancon, Cox
ON TOP OF THAT..we have the minor league starters like Marquez, McCutchen, Steve White, Garcia, Pope or even Horne that could make a Joba splash in the pen.
ON TOP OF THAT…other solid minor league RP guys like Whelan, Robertson, both are power arms making their way through the system.
What does this all mean? It means that there is power in numbers. We can assume that 3 of the 10 bullpen spots will be occupied, the other 7 could be an open competition between the 20 or so other options. SOME of those guys will emerge.
Did anyone know about Fernando Rodney and Zumaya a couple years ago? Did anyone outside of NY know about Joba before last year? Did the Sox think they had the next Mo with Paps 3 years ago? Players emerge all the time, maybe we have one or two of these guys already and just don’t know yet. I would rather take my chances with these young power arms, then continue to sign on these “vets” that will be assured a spot and will undoubtedly flounder ( do I really need to go over the list of these RP’s we have signed on in the past 10 years? ) I wont since this post is long enough…lol
( if you made it this far, we are almost done )
SO IN CONCLUSION, without making and BIG SPLASHES in the FA market, the Yanks are a better team. We will also have a new coach, who I love, in Joe Girardi. Joe will employ a more attacking NL style to the Bronx. Look what Joe did with the Marlins who had the lowest payroll in the league, they just missed the playoffs. What will he do with the highest payroll in the league?.
I CANT WAIT FOR THIS SEASON TO START!!!!
PS. We will only get better as these young guys come into their own!!! The future is bright my brothers and sisters!
IF THE KIDS SUCK WILL VIPER AND PETER AND CO , EAT CROW??
Depends what your definition of "suck" is. If they ALL have a down year this season; their ERA's are in the upper 4's, lower 5's...that still would not change my mind on their future outlook. If they duplicated that again in 09, still not a big deal due to their age. I will "eat crow" on them not fulfilling their potential 5 years from now. At that time they will all be 27-28, that is the START of a player's physical peak. If they are still not successful at that point, then YES, we would be wrong.
Honestly though, I would MUCH rather be wrong with the three kids not fulfilling their potential than to be wrong by doing what we have done the past 8 years of signing overpriced "vets" that fail. To me, that is the lesser of two evils.
NOW YOU SOUND LIKE A HYPROCRITE...
eat crow" on them not fulfilling their potential 5 years from now. At that time they will all be 27-28, that is the START of a player's physical peak.
IS'NT JOHANN THAT AGE NOW?
CASE CLOSED
Thanks there Johnny Cockring for solving this mystery...lol
Like I said before...
" I will "eat crow" on them not fulfilling their potential 5 years from now. At that time they will all be 27-28, that is the START of a player's physical peak. If they are still not successful at that point, then YES, we would be wrong"
Sooooooo, if he hasnt done anything up until he is age 27, then yes I will be wrong. Johan had his best years at 25, 26 and 27...hence if Phil hasnt done anything by that time, I would be wrong. Not sure how you twisted that statement to make me a hypocrite.
As far as my stance against Johan, it was never because of his age ( 29 ), it is because of his innings ( 1000 over 4 years which led the entire league ). Some players peak early, while others peak late. My statement about "27-28, that is the START of a player's physical peak", is a general standard for when players come into their own, be it baseball, football, hockey or any other sport.
CASE REOPENED
Hey DRU, I'm eatin' crow right now. Is good. MMMMMMM. Tastes a lot like chicken.
Joba is star, Hughes is stud, Kennedy is horse. Together make starstudhorse. Better than crow. Maybe Johan is crow? Nawww, Johan is Met.
By the way, you're right about Abreu. He's going to have a career year and more than make up for Posada's dropoff and Posada will do the same with less singles. ARod is not going to dropoff. I'd say they'll walk him more and they will, but not too much because there will be too many guys on base in front of him.
Hey ANONYMOUS, Santana is 29, dumbass.