STATE OF THE LIGHTHOUSE PROJECT: My Q&A with Town of Hempstead Supervisor Kate Murray
I spoke with the Town of Hempstead supervisor Kate Murray for close to an hour yesterday evening about the status of Lighthouse Project, and here’s my take on where things stand.
It is my belief that the Lighthouse Project folks and the Town of Hempstead are engaged essentially in a negotiation right now over what the final plans for the project will be.
Look at it as a typical free-agent negotiation in baseball. The Mets’ first offer to Francisco Rodriguez will be lower than they expect to pay him, and Rodriguez’s asking price will be more than he expects to receive. Then, in the end, they meet somewhere in the middle. That’s what goes on in these types of real-estate deals, as well.
Murray, as you’ll see in the Q&A below, makes a point of mentioning several times that she has a standing offer with Islanders owner Charles Wang and project partner Scott Rechler to redevelop Nassau Coliseum separate from the bells-and-whistles Lighthouse Project. That, in my estimation, represents her bottom offer. Not surprisingly, Wang and co. have consistently and emphatically declined that offer.
Meanwhile, think of the current Lighthouse Plans – which you can see here – as a pie-in-the-sky offer by Wang and Rechler. In an ideal world, that’s what they want the final plans to look like.
At the end of my Q&A with Murray, I painted the baseball free-agent scenario as my read on the situation. When I asked specifically if that’s essentially what’s taking place here, she did not say no. “It’s a process,” she said.
As for specifics, the scoping document is apparently close to being finished, which means that once that is in the hands of the Lighthouse Project folks they can submit their draft of the environmental review. Wang has said he wanted to submit that by July. Obviously the process is four months behind that. What that means for his goal of breaking ground next July is anyone’s guess. Murray declined to speculate about that.
My guess: they will break ground, but only after the two sides come to an agreement on a scaled-down plan. But negotiations are tricky, as we see each off-season in every sport. So, you know the saying, until that shovel gets placed in the ground…
Q&A with Murray after the jump...
THIS IS THE Q&A WITH MURRAY:
ON HOW LONG THIS IS TAKING…
We talked with Charles Wang and the developers for probably almost five years while they were preparing their application. We didn’t actually get the application, despite much fanfare, for over many, many years. We didn’t have it delivered until November of 2007, just over a year ago. It wasn’t actually finally finished, the application itself, until February of this year. So we’ve only had a completed application for approximately nine months…
In a lot of people’s mind I’m sure it’s, ‘Wow, this application has been out there for a thousand years! What the heck is going on?’ ... The fact is we’ve truly had the application for nine months…
As long as four years ago I had offered specifically to the developers... to redevelop the Coliseum as a stand alone project separate and apart from the Lighthouse Project itself. Only from the perspective that it is an existing building and it would be far less cumbersome and far less complicated to have a redevelopment scenario on the Coliseum.
[Wang] respectfully declined on the record this past February and said he preferred to have the redevelopment of the Coliseum part and parcel with the other parts of the Lighthouse development. That’s his choice... The offer is absolutely still on the table... The town stands ready, willing and able to assist him on that part in a very expedited way…
I just want to make it clear to Islanders fans and to whoever else is interested that in no uncertain terms I have made the offer to segregate out the Coliseum. Obviously the entire Lighthouse Project is far more involved, particularly from an environmental point of view.
WHAT’S BEEN GOING ON LAST FEW MONTHS?
We held two scoping hearings in May. Basically you get from the public their potential issues, things they’re concerned about in a potential project. As part of that scoping document, it’s dependent on input from all parties that may identify environmental issues in need of a response. For example, the New York State Department of Transportation, Department of Environmental Conservation, Nassau County Department of Health, LIPA, KeySpan, the water department, on and on and on. All of those departments can and will comment on the implications of this kind of project…
To speed that process along, we’ve been forwarding to the Lighthouse Group the issues that are being identifying at the scoping sessions so they can get a jump on trying to address them, come up with responses. So this way the developers’ draft of the environmental impact statement will probably be in 90 percent range by the time they actually receive the scoping document itself. Most times, I mean always, you go through this environmental review, then you hand over the documents to the developers. That’s the first time they get a word of the issues that were brought up during the scoping sessions, and then they begin to craft a response. With the Lighthouse Project, as those issues are coming up, we’re literally funneling them to the Lighthouse people so they can almost simultaneously come up with responses, investigations, etc…
WHAT HAPPENS AFTER THE DRAFT OF THE ENVIRONMENTAL REVIEW IS FILED?
Then basically [the environmental review statement] is a working document going back and forth with all the agencies. The Town of Hempstead is one cog in the big wheel. All those agencies will take a look at the response from the developer. That process is going to be what it’s going to be. I can’t even project what that might be simply because I won’t have control over the agencies. Obviously we’re going to try to dispatch that part of the process as fast as we can, but again the fact remains there are a number of agencies that will have their eyes on that statement.
ON WHY SHE SAYS THE TOWN IS NOT AT FAULT FOR SLOW DOINGS...
I get it. The perception is going to be, if there is any delays, ‘oh, it’s the town’s fault.’ Hopefully it’s not going to be true. To this point that hasn’t been true. We’re at the mercy, in a sense, to all those outside agencies who by definition must weigh in on the process, too. You don’t have control over everything, which sometimes make it frustrating. Not so far. Everyone’s been OK. The agencies, although, we haven’t even gotten full information now, and it’s November. Sometimes it’s frustrating. I want to move as expeditiously as I can on this project, but maybe not every agency shares.
DO YOU THINK THEY CAN BREAK GROUND NEXT JULY?
I couldn’t even comment on that. There are so many things that are unknowable at this time. We don’t even have the draft of the environmental impact statement yet. Once we get that then all of these agencies put on their glasses and look at it. That’s when the conversations begin. I’m just not even going to speculate on that. There’s just a lot of work to be done.
DO YOU FEEL URGENCY TO GET A SHOVEL IN THE GROUND?
My most important priority is to do it right. This is by far the largest proposed development in Nassau County today. And it will affect many communities, generations upon generations to come. I feel very much a responsibility to do it right...
I am absolutely expediting everything that I can in the process for the Lighthouse group, but I will never expedite just to be hasty, as opposed to being complete and thorough. The thoroughness will never be given up just to get something done. But I’m cognizant of the interest in the development. Heck, that’s why I offered to segregate the coliseum itself out. And I stand ready, willing and able to segregate that part of it out.
WHAT’S YOUR REACTION TO NHL COMMISH GARY BETTMAN PUBLICLY URGING TOWN OFFICIALS TO MOVE THIS ALONG…
I’ve got to tell you, that’s the least of my worries. Frankly he’s not even on the radar screen for me. I’m much more concerned about the residents, the communities, this development, how it affects our communities, how it affects our residents, the environmental impact of all these buildings, that’s really what concerns me. Quite frankly, the NHL guy can wax poetic all he wants. That’s the least of my worries.
THIS IS THE POINT I MENTIONED MY COMPARISON TO THIS SITUATION TO THAT OF A FREE-AGENT NEGOTIATION. THUS, I ASKED IF SHE COULD FORESEE PERHAPS THE FINAL PLANS SCALED BACK TO THE POINT WHERE BOTH SIDES ARE HAPPY?
I can’t comment on specifics because ultimately I have to vote on this whole thing. I have to be very careful about giving opinions. However, the fact is that in just about every development negotiations do go on and drawings get tweaked and visions get amended. Hey, before he even submitted his application he got rid of the lighthouse. So clearly life is a negotiation and so is developments. More specific than that I feel constrained to speak about specifics because ultimately I will have to sit in judgement of this whole thing. But that is absolutely a truism to say negotiations are part in parcel of really just about every development that comes through the Town of Hempstead and dare I say every municipality that has zoning powers.
SO THEREFORE I’D THINK IT’S REASONABLE TO ASSUME THAT TALKS HAVE TAKEN PLACE BETWEEN YOU AND THE LIGHTHOUSE ABOUT MEETING IN THE MIDDLE, AND PERHAPS EVEN PLANS HAVE GONE BACK AND FORTH THAT WE DON’T KNOW ABOUT.
It’s a process, a process that takes a long time. I would say - without being specific - it’s a process.
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Comments (26)
Old lady: "The Islanders? Right here on Long Island? I didn't know we still had a team."
Jake Taylor: Yup, we've got uniforms and everything. It's really great."
GO RIEBER !!
Well, there's a bit of CYA here, but I would hope this is the first of several efforts to make sure that Ms. Murray is indeed accountable to the people she serves. But keep up the pressure.
You really don't know what you have in a franchise until it leaves. Even the Coyotes' decision to locate on the west side of Phoenix in Glendale instead of the East Valley (Scottsdale) as had been assumed has had a far-reaching impact.
This is a politician, let's remember that very carefully. So basically, we can guarantee 99 out of 100 times that she is lying, and everything she says has to be neutral-minded to please as many constituents as possible. The one part that bothers me tremendously is how many times she reiterates the fact of "we still have a stand-alone coliseum renovation standing offer." She would LOVE for that to be the end of it, because why would she want to take the time to work more and review more. Here is the biggest problem: Nassau County is as corrupt as they come. Since it is a self-financed project, money isn't able to pass from hand to hand. I bet if Kate Murray was making a few dollars on the side, groundbreak would be happening the day after the Islanders season is over. How about she does less talking and more working, because as an Islanders fan, I am sick and tired of watching this garbage be drawn out weeks and months longer than it needs to be.
Good Job Jim Baumbach.
My only condern with what I read here is Ms. Murray COMPLETELY blowing off Bettmann. (Not that he doesn't deserve it sometimes.....but Ya Know?)
How many Town Supervisors are in the habit of telling the CEO of a major employer and a source of tourism revenue within their domain to "bett" out and mind his own business?
Ms Murray.
Your comments directed at Gary Bettmann were ill-advised, myopic, and just a tad on the scary side.
I understand that you do not want to appear to be bullied by Mr. Bettman, but your comments have a certain paranoia to them.
The guy brings a lot of revenue to your small businesses and provide jobs for your residents.
Just my opinion, from someone two time zones away who visits a couple of times a years and spends a lot of money in Borrelli's, the Marriott and most importantly, your delis.
What will they do with the Islanders while A) a new coliseum is being built, or B) the existing coliseum is being renovated........Where will the Islanders play while this construction is going on? Nobody has brought this up yet
Expanding on Justin's and Brook's comments, this is the most obnoxious interview. It made me sick reading it. It is wrought with condescension and non-answers. I'm anxious to hear Wang and Bettman's rebuttal. Islander fans are so low on this woman's priorities; she cannot make it any clearer.
It's all the "agencies" responsibilities. Wow, what a leader.
Murray, have some respect for what the Islanders have been to your community for the last 30+ years. How about telling us how you really feel. I know nothing about Murray, just third party reads and the responses in this interview which are defensive non-answers. I think this goes beyond political speak, it's laziness and indifference. The baseball free agent analogy only works hear if one side has no interest in making a deal.
The only thing I can find on the Hempstead website is that meetings will be held in May of 2007.
As mentioned earlier Murray is a politician, so the comments regarding Bettman doesn't worry me too much. He's not a voter in the town of Hempstead so Murray really doens't have to care about him.
We all want this thing out of the way so we can be assured that the Isles will be staying on Long Island. So hurry up!!
Wang CAN’T build just the Coliseum because he’s basically asking the Town to yank the rug out from under the rest of the project. At that point he would probably abandon it unless the taxpayers pony up the difference.
This to me is a politician playing politics. She doesn’t know if the shovels can be in the ground because environmental review isn’t complete and there’s no agreement on the final scope. Those negotiations could take a week or 6 months, and nobody can know for sure.
The Lighthouse is moving forward, and I believe with all my heart there’s too much momentum to stop it now. To help, write to her (the address is in the link), because politicians respond to voters more than anything else. If voters want it, then politicians usually follow suit.
Everyone also check BD Gallof’s (and my! haha) take on the current state of the project, based on interviews and the latest round of hearings:
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/BD-Gallof/The-Lighthouse-Project-Blame-Game-Your-Guide-To-Where-It-Really-Stands/85/18073
Also, RS, to answer your question...renovations would be largely over the summer, and the Islanders would play the month of October on the road every year while it was happening. They would try to do as much work on the outside of the building as they could during the season so as not to disturb the fans.
In this day and age when pro sports teams are holding a gun to the head of local governments saying "build us a billion dollar arena with luxury boxes and free flowing champaigne or we're moving the team to Las Vegas," Nassau County is faced with an owner who just wants to build his own arena. Somehow, the corrupt politicians (pardon the redundancy) still cannot seem to be able to get out of the way!?!
Pardon my ignorance, but exactly what is the "other side" to this decision? The Rangers don't want the comeptition? We settled that one in 1972 with Roy Boe and bankruptcy! The only owner in pro sports that wants to build his own arena, and there's a debate?
Get serious Nassau County or the Isles will be forced to move eventually!
GET OUT OF THE WAY!!!
Nick,
Wow, the month of October on the road huh? What a disadvantage that would be, but I guess it's really the only plausable way to do this.....I'd settle for a month on the road than an eternity off Long Island.
**Rather than**
How can anybody justify having a new shopping mall 200 yards from Roosevelt Field? How does that help LI? And what does that have to do with the Isalanders?
Murray is right, she gave the coliseum deal to Wang years ago, but Wang wants to rake the taxpayers over the coals with his insane idea to have a shopping mall, housing, a nightlife center, and a lighthouse. This guy has to be joking. Who is dumb enough to hand over land and town resources to Wang?
He owns a hockey team that he barely invests in already. They have the lowest payroll and some of the highest ticket prices in the NHL, and for that the people and gov't of LI are going to hand this guy free land and resources?
Wow!
Kate comes off as both obnoxious and defensive! The biggest bs is the part about the application "only" being in for 9 months!
Why do you think they've been talking for 5 years?!!!!!!! So when they submit the final application the town can act on it right away because they know whats coming.
She doesnt want to make a decision bc its her butt on the line and she delays and waits for other agencies to go on the record so she can cover her butt if anything does go wrong.
Saying yes to the project is a risk for her while delaying doesnt cost her anything unless it threatens her chance at re-election or to move to higher office.
In that case, we know what we have to do...
John Keitz........"Nassau County is faced with an owner who just wants to build his own arena"
Are you really that ill informed? He can have the arena at any time. Did you even read the article?
He wants housing, a shopping mall, a nightlife center, a lighthouse and finally yes an arena too.
Before you take the time to post, try reading first.
The fact is that Wanger is losing 20 MILLION $'s a year. Renovating the Coliseum is not going to change that. He needs the Lighthouse to make sure he starts making some money back. If this does not happen, he will be forced to sell. Nobody in their right mind would buy the Isles after seeing how hard it is to get anything done in Nassau (with the exception of moving the team). The whole project gets done or the Isles are gone. Plain and simple. Make it happen!
Greg/Ray, you are seriously so wrong you can't even see right on the horizon. There is no "mall," but if people live there they would need a place to shop. How is Wang a thief for wanting to build his own arena while finding a way to recoup his investment? How is that worse than the Steinbrenners demolishing 2 public parks and getting half a billion from the taxpayers to build a new Yankee Stadium (I'm a Yankee fan, but that's fact)? Give me a break.
at this point i want to see the islanders move to suffolk first or just leave second. this is coming from a big isles fan. just tired of it.
Whoa....just got done reading Chris Botta's rebuttal to Ms. Murray on his blog.
All I can say is "Whoa....."
After reading Botta's response....I sure hope there is a contingency plan somewhere to name the new arena the Kate Murray Arena......cuz if she reads Botta's blog entry, naming rights may very well be the only recourse to getting all of this approved.
"How is Wang a thief for wanting to build his own arena while finding a way to recoup his investment?"
I never called him a thief, and why are you bringing the Yanks into this?
Are you serioulsy saying that Wang needs to make extra money so give him land/resouces for housing, a shopping center (a mall), and a nighlife center? He is too dumb to make money running the Islanders? He deserves special treatment because he owns the Isles? It's a no-good hockey team. That's all they are.
He'll probably do just as shoddy a job running his nightlife/housing/shopping center as he does running the Isles.
What did he do with all that land he had in Oyster Bay?
Why is his successor at CA, Kumar, in jail? This Wang is one shady man.
I get it that some people, about 10k maybe 40x a year enjoy a hockey game, but that doesn't mean LI should give in to his outrageous demands.
Bottom line - He has carte blanche to build an arean, do it.........stay out of the housing, shopping, nightlife business on the tax payers dime.
You have not justified how it's the taxpayers' dime, you've just said it and hoped nobody called you on it. The County, and by extension, the taxpayers, lose about $1.5 million on the site right now. The iron-clad lease with SMG makes it impossible to make any money on the arena until 2015. That's a big reason the team loses money, and it's ludicrous to blame Wang for something signed 20 years ago long before he bought the team. Building just the arena is incredibly myopic, because you still can't recoup your investment. You think anybody is willing to throw $400 million (that's the estimated cost of renovating the Coliseum into a true major-league facility) into developing the arena with no way of making the money back? Who in their right mind would do that? Confining development to just the arena is the easiest way to make sure the taxpayers actually do end up paying for it.
The development, which NASSAU COUNTY required as part of the competitive bidding process, is meant to create a center and start a new era of smart growth and actually keeping younger people on Long Island. So how is Wang soaking the taxpayers by following the parameters of a competitive bidding process and subsequently winning that bid? How is following Nassau County's vision a bad play by Wang? How is being willing to invest billions of dollars into an asphalt jungle without asking the taxpayers for any large share of the project soaking the taxpayers? Seriously, if you want to just admit you're a NIMBY and won't support anything on the site, please do so and allow me to save my breath.
The offer to just re-develop the site is a ruse and an insult. Anybody who doesn't see the economic need to put something on that site is willingly ignoring the facts.
Nick... seriously stop drinking the Islanders/ wang kool-aid. If you knew anything about how Wang really is, he's not the person you want to work for (ask any former CA, Isles, Dragons, Neulion employees, etc ) nevermind trust.... You really need a reality check
Wang will spend $320 million for renovations and new parking facilities at the Coliseum. His proposal also calls for extending the Islanders' lease on the Coliseum through 2025 and for the construction of a sports technology center, housing and a conference facility.
What happens after 2025, Does Wang then knock down the Coliseum and sell the team so he can put up more housing? He could make back the 320 million and then some with the sale of the team. He would then have control of the land to do what he wants. If you think he wants the Islanders for the love of the team I think you are highly mistaken. I live in Nassau County and an Islander Fans since they began, with the county closing sewer plants and the traffic on the Meadowbrook and Hempstead Turnpike at rush hour the schools busting at the seems. Keeping the Islanders hear for a lousy 15 more years isn't worth the problem this will cause.
Another thing, Why didn't Wang buy out SMG it would have cost a little more then Yashin with much better returns. Is it so he could keep complaining about losing money and how much he needs the project to go through to survive. He's a land developer not a Hockey team owner.
I need a reality check? Seriously? I spent years reading every objective study and report related to this project. I've called economists and other business leaders to get their objective take on the project (all in favor, by the way), and people who respond with emotional Wang hatred tell me I need a reality check?
Nassau County has attempted to buy out SMG in the past, and SMG has refused. Look it up. The County could and should condemn the lease but for some reason they haven't. I wish our man Suozzi would get on that.
Nassau County required that any proposal for the Coliseum site include a new arena and a plan for the rest of the land. So how is conforming to the vision that Nassau County set for the site turning Wang into someone who's soaking the taxpayers? Simply renovating the arena gives the Town carte blanche to yank the rest of the project out from under the Lighthouse people. Would anyone here voluntarily surrender their biggest piece of leverage in a negotiation? Nobody has given me a coherent answer on that, I've only been accused of drinking the Wang Kool-Aid and of actually being Chris Dey in disguise. Yet, somehow, I'm the Kool-Aid drinker who's disconnected from reality.
I wish everyone here a happy Thanksgiving. I'm glad to have a debate on this, but it doesn't work unless we keep it to the facts.
I am concerned with the quality of life issue. I don't know if you travel in that area at rush hour or if you have kids in the neighboring areas. It will be a strain on all around. If they can explain how they will fix these problems then I will be for the project.
I don't think any businessman like Wang is going to buy the team without a plan to make lots of money which had to include cheap land in the heart of Nassau County.
Call me a pessimist but I find something funny when the lead negotiator for SMG ( Former Senator Alphonse (pothole) D'Amato) is also on the board of Computer Associates. And effectively shut out the Gutowski group and his good friend Wang bought the team. Gutowski group wanted to buy the Islanders but knew it wasn't viable with the SMG lease and tried to negotiate a buyout. I guess Wang didn't know that. (I find that hard to believe.) That is why I find it hard to trust Wang.
My family is my main concern, not the Islanders and if this effects our quality of life then I have to question it.
I think the land is more important to Wang then the Islanders. That's what makes him a good business man and if I was him I wouldn't fix the Coliseum without the OK for the rest either.
If The Islanders are your main concern, have Mr. Wang guarantee more then 15 years.
I guess we will have to wait for the reports to come back with the results for traffic, environment and school populations before we can make a educated decision on the project.
Frank, I understand what you mean on that end. I went to school on Glenn Curtiss Blvs from Grades 6-12, so I was in rush hour in that area practically every school day from September 1996 to June 2003. There are surely issues to resolve, but that's why the environmental impact statement is being constructed, to identify issues and recommend ways to fix it. In addition, having a project that large can attract money from the federal government to get a real transportation solution in there.
I'll admit hockey got me into the project from the beginning, but I realized early on this was more than a hockey issue. I'm one of the many younger Long Islanders who doesn't see a future here and is looking to leave for a lack of opportunity. I also see how Robert Moses' dream of a car-driven Island is turning into a nightmare, and how we need to be a bit smarter about growing and utilizing the areas in our Island. I want a reason to raise my future kids on this Island, and something like this that addresses many large issues could absolutely do that.
As for the Islanders' lease, there would be a 99-year lease on the site. To use the Yankees as an example again, they have a 30-year lease on the new ballpark they're building. That doesn't necessarily mean they'll leave, just that there will be another negotiation. I'm trying not to expect the worst because of the 15-year extension of the lease, especially since there are SMG and other cash flow-related issues to tackle.
Traffic is a fact of life for us on the Island, but to me the only way to provide a long-term solution is to think big. I hope you come to the public hearings and read the environmental report (as I hope to) to see how your issues are being resolved.
Amazing project, has to get done. Bring to Nets over, too...